I received an unusual press release today, from the BBB, saying they recommended Stihl discontinue their unqualified “made in America” claims for outdoor power tools and equipment.
The BBB’s National Advertising Division (NAD) says that, following a challenge brought by a competing tool brand, their recommendation was that Stihl:
Discontinue its unqualified “Made in America” claims; and
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Modify its “Made in America” claims to make clear that not all (or virtually all) of its products are made in the United States and that not all (or virtually all) of the parts of those products are from the United States.
The BBB NAD adds that:
The challenged claims, on Stihl’s website, social media, commercials, and print ads stated that its products are “Made in America.” The claim was made in connection with the brand generally in a variety of contexts (at times with power tools visible in the ad) along with images of the American flag. Stihl usually included a disclosure stating, “A majority of STIHL products sold in America are made in America of U.S. and global materials.”
NAD concluded that notwithstanding the disclosure, consumers would take away a broad, unqualified message that all or virtually all of its products – and all or virtually all of those products’ parts – are made in America.
According to the BBB:
Stihl stated that it “agrees to comply with NAD’s recommendations” although it “believes that its advertising verbiage and methods have truthfully conveyed its qualified Made in USA claims.”
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On Stihl’s website, they say that:
A majority of STIHL products sold in America are made right here in Virginia Beach from U.S. and global materials.
I found examples of Stihl’s “Made in America” claims.
It seems that, according to the BBB, consumers were misinterpreting the claim, even with the disclosure.
The BBB doesn’t provide details about how they “concluded that notwithstanding the disclosure, consumers would take away a broad, unqualified message that all or virtually all of its products – and all or virtually all of those products’ parts – are made in America.”
See the BBB Feb 2024 Statement
Looking deeper, this wasn’t the first time the BBB NAD made recommendations to Stihl over their made in America advertising claims.
In October 2013, the BBB issued a statement, saying:
The National Advertising Division has determined that STIHL Incorporated can support a “Built in America” advertising claim featured in national advertising, but recommended the company make an accompanying disclosure more prominent.
Peter
The fine print like the one in the pic with the guy looking into the camera ist like the word but in a sentence.
Generally you can forget everything said or printed before that.
Tom
“What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away” : Tom Waits, “Step Right Up”
Keith
20 years ago, my Nephew learned this fact. He had bought a new mountain bike and was pretty proud of it. Pointing to the sticker on the downtube he exclaimed. “Look, made in USA!!”
Hated to burst his bubble, but had him look closer.
Mfg had played with the font size to intentionally mislead.
“MADE IN china, designed in USA”
The smaller font was really small, and overwhelmed by the red, white and blue flag!
Greg
I wonder which competing brand got this ball rolling.
It’s not a challenge from consumer complaints, it’s from someone who would benefit from Stihl not being able to make the claim of “made in america”
Lance
That’s the first thing I thought while reading the article… who stands to benefit?
Clientgraphics
The challenge was brought by Milwaukee Electric Tool Corporation. Apparently there were some ads on Stihl’s website, social media, commercials and print ads that stated its products are “made in America” but did not included a disclosure or seek to clarify exactly what is exactly made in America.
It could have been as simple as a new hire marketing individual or even an intern mistake. However one should not advertise in a factory with multiple power tools and outdoor equipment without further clarification/disclosure what it is you are marketing.
When you company has both made in USA products with global materials and products from other countries of origin you have to market correctly and fairly.
Charles
My brother is in qc at the plant and they make great products! I thought it was common knowledge that they were german. I started using there products in the mid 80’s at 16yrs old and knew that. Sthil is very proud of their operations in va Beach and employees alot of Americans.
Adam
If the other items are coming from Germany, I really don’t have a problem with Stihl’s advertising. If they have to, I’m fine seeing the German flag next to the American in terms of quality.
Made in the USA, or Germany, is going to to be umpteen times better than some Chinisium garbage.
Charles
Va Beach plant builds alot of units but a few products come from Germany because it’s not cost effective to make them here. My brother is very proud of the products they produce. Everyone in our family uses sthil products and I have several that are 20 plus years old that I treat very badly still going strong.
Scott K
I replaced my Echo backpack blower with a Stihl a few months ago and I’m very happy with it so far. My Echo was great for years, but I had the same part go 3 times in 2 years and decided to get it repaired one final time and sell it while it still had some value.
John
Stihl chainsaws are the best out there, whether they are made in the USA or not. I own 3 Stihl Chainsaws, 2 made in the USA and 1 made in West Germany. No matter if they are made in the USA or not, Stihl will only sell their outdoor power equipment in authorized dealers, they will not sell their products in Home Depot or Lowe’s. Any Stihl dealer must service any tool they sell.
Chris
Stihl is sold at ace hardware which is on the same grade as Lowes or Home depot as far as “trust this hourly worker they hired to repair my tool” in my mind.
Andy
They sell them at the local Ace hardware here and do not service them….
Eliot Truelove
It’s unfortunate that people view “Made in (Country)” claims as somehow making the product inherently better or worse, but I have no problem with where components are made or even where it is assembled so long as the quality control and engineering are top notch.
A product can be Made in America from a shady company and be a garbage product and another can be Made in Mexico or China but be from a top company and be quality. There really is no way to know the quality control though, so people associate the country with the quality.
Made in Japan and Made in Taiwan are usually indicators of quality, but even then they may be globally sourced components. People claim that JDM (Japanese Domestic Market) versions of vehicles, tools, and electronics are inherently better, but sometimes the only difference is the quality control in the assembly, whereas the components are identical to the international models. People claim this exact thing of Makita, even using entirely different generations of products in their testing and highlighting the differences, whereas the parts 99% of the time are identical and interchangeable when they are across equivalent model numbers.
I know Leatherman assemble products in their Pacific Northwest factory but source various components from China, and some people have been up in arms about that claiming the steel isn’t as good or they wear out too quickly etc.
Either way, due diligence on the manufacturers part to ensure quality goes a long way.
Stuart
When people are unfamiliar with a brand or products, they might apply what they know to form a conclusion.
I see it as a form of transitive logic.
USA-made tools are generally high quality. If presented with two brands, Stihl or a competing brand, Stihl’s advertising might lead to “Stihl is made in America, made in America is better, Stihl is better” reasoning, even if the products in question are not made in America.
It seems that the BBB NAD determined this reasoning was likely for Stihl products that aren’t made in America, which would explain their recommendations.
Kyle
Even if it paints with a broad brush there is some wisdom in consumers inferring where the bar for quality is set by country of origin. Labor, real estate, energy etc. are expensive in highly industrialized countries like the US, Germany and Japan. If it’s expensive to make things in these countries, the only way those products can compete is on quality and design. They have to contend with lower tier imports on overall value, but simply cannot afford to make cheap junk. China would eat their lunch on price alone. With lower operating costs, products made in developing countries have much more room to compete on price, which means they can cover a much wider variety of quality standards. China in particular manufactures tools that range from high quality at an excellent value to the cheapest possible gimmicky junk that looks like it came from a cereal box. I have Stihl products from the US and Germany that have served well for decades. I also love my professional quality Milwaukee power tools that were made in made in China, and certainly not the cheapest options on the market. County of origin can suggest a lower limit on quality but certainly isn’t the whole story. As competitive as the market for tools is you usually get what you pay for.
Peter
While I would expect Made in USA or America has a high quality.
For me it is more that my money stays more in the US than overseas.
Jack Brown
The point of Made in America is for those of us who want to support American workers and American industrial capacity, vs just buying whatever is cheapest.
Gordon
Except a majority of “Made in America” products are made with prison labor. So the only thing you’re doing is paying a premium for a slogan that only serves to enrich the corporations and privatized prisons.
Stuart
No.
None of the factories I’ve toured have been inside prisons.
Andy
I’d love to hear why you believe this. It certainly hasn’t been true in my experience, but I’m no expert in the subject.
Jerry
That is just it though: leathermans current tools are SUBSTANTIALLY worse. I use one every day and depend on it so the change is frustrating. While not conclusive, a Made in XYZ is often a reasonable shortcut when there are so many options, and supporting local jobs and generally better working conditions and environmental practices is never a bad idea. That change of COO by leatherman roughly correlates with changes in manufacturing location as near as I can tell. They do wear out more quickly too. While not Milwaukee level of bad*, they’re bad. Taking the charge+ TTi which should be a flagship level product.
-the pivots are bead blasted not polished which wears out the spacer rings(now of lower quality metal) and makes rusting more common.
-the knife blades while theoretically better steel have a poorer heat treat, and unbalanced though not uneven grinds.
-the tools have noticeable machining marks and are less accurately cut, fixed screw driver and can opener are worse
-the working edges are shorter, easier to make but less useful.
-the wood saw has noticeable ‘flashing’ on the teeth and the teeth are less sharp and even.
-plier pivot and flex are worse though the crimper and replaceable jaws are nice, the wire cutters meet less accurately and roll/pinch multistrand instead of a clean cut unless it’s twisted first.
-multi bits are now painted black instead of the earlier greenish treatment, paint flakes and the steel is softer leading to distorted/twisted bits on Phillips/flat respectively.
the file/metal saw is the worst of all:
-Saw edge stops 20% farther from the pivot and it’s cut down for easier machining so it catches every pass. Teeth are worse cut with no set.
Diamond file is of lower grade and less even particles, no longer useful for a quick sharpen, plus wears more quickly.
-cut file is utterly useless, ends early as well shortening the stroke which doesn’t matter since the teeth are so poorly cut it skates instead of biting on mild steel. Reminds me of a $10 multi tool. Even on fingernails the cut is noticeably worse.
The above comparison came about because I lost a very early solid jaw model bought a new one a year later excited for the replaceble cutters. Found it again and then side by side in use noted the changes that I couldn’t see. The file/metal saw on the original was STILL faster after a decade of hard use. I thought I’d been too hard on bits only to discover the old ones didn’t fail when swapped in etc.
*This is not an arbitrary statement, or comment on their excellent power tools. I have photos on the latter, of their hardline dropped point. purchased 4 of the same know from various locations to see if it was a bad batch. Without exaggeration, they had the worst grinds I’ve seen, including dollar store knives. Completely uneven, multi faceted and almost unusable.
Jerry
Honestly my first thought of something made in the USA isn’t that it is somehow automatically higher in quality so much as I know it wasn’t built by child laborers working in a sweatshop who’s only real safety equipment would be nets hung outside the factory to prevent people from committing suicide by jumping out an upper floor window.
Bob
Just to note that “Made in America” is a lot broader than if they said “Made in the USA”. It could cover the US, Canada, Mexico, Caribbean, Latin, and South America.
The USA flag in the picture makes one assume it is made in the USA, but not the same as saying it.
Mike
Wrong. You stated countries in North America. North America does not equal America.
ITCD
It’s clear what they mean, because America is always used for United States of America. It doesn’t say North America or South America, and people who say America aren’t referring to the continent, and people who refer to Americans aren’t referring to people from Canada or Paraguay or Jamaica or Brazil. This sounds similar to people who say stuff like “it just says U.S.A. not *made in* U.S.A. therefore it’s not actually made here.”
The FTC rules state that even simply a flag can be taken as a COO declaration. Of course context matters, so it would be on a case by case basis that it’s determined if it was meant for that or not.
Mike
If you have to put an asterisk alongside your major advertising claim, you need to rewrite that claim.
But if the non-USA tools are made in Germany, I’d insert that somewhere, because there’s still a bias that German manufacturing is top notch. That asterisk might lead people to believe the non-USA tools are made in the Far East, which would probably lead some buyers to turn away.
William Adams
The thing is, Made in Germany is well-regarded, so I would think that they would get a lot of mileage out of stating that, and they could do a Mac vs. PC like campaign where they state it’s an either or and have two personalities going back and forth about which is better, or better still, noting what the other side does better and why said process happens where it does.
MM
In the case of Stihl in particular their German products are indeed very well regarded. Generally speaking it is the top-of-the line models which are made in Germany, and many enthusiasts see that as a sign of quality, sort of like how many people prefer the Made-in-Japan Makitas. Chainsaw nerds love German-made Stihls.
William Adams
Yeah, I regret that I left all my father’s Stihl chainsaws to be auctioned off.
Grokew
You are describing something similar to the old Audi commercial, that mentions the positive traits of Alfa Romeo, Mercedes-Benz, Volvo, and BMW, and then it forms the Audi logo, implying that Audi has all of those positive traits combined.
blocky
I agree with your assertion*
*I said what I said.
Kentucky fan
Some of their cheaper stuff comes from china but is still very good. This is all around idiotic nonsense the United States has stupid high standards for something to be made in USA with no qualifiers.
Charles
Are you sure about that? I was under the impression that nothing comes from China except probably the batteries. My brother went to China to help them set up a plant there but it was for the Chinese domestic market only. I have been in the plant and seen with my own eyes them making alot of parts. Pistons, cranks, injection molding, chainsaw bars, you name it.
Kentucky fan
Their cheap crooked shaft weedeater is china made. But that’s all I’ve ever seen.
Adam
Cough cough…DeWalt 20v* cough
I know they have the astrix on every box, but there are plenty of dotes out there still believing DeWalt 20v > 18v
John
The validity of Stihl’s marketing claim depends in part on the audience. Manufacturers need to be aware of the rules and regulations surrounding country of origin for the different agencies that they work with; US Customs, Federal Trade Commission, BBB, etc.. Each agency has it’s own guidelines about what “Made in America” means, and these are often very different from each other and may even conflict. One agency might agree that a product is Made in America because it is assembled in the US with global components, while another may require the vast majority of components and assembly come from US sources. The FTC is probably the toughest standard and requires that majority of the products value (material, manufacturing labor, overhead) come from US sources to carry a Made in USA claim. Based on the BBBs public notices, it sounds like Stihl may be bending the rules and implying things that aren’t necessarily true.
ITCD
BBB isn’t an agency though. It’s great grandma’s Yelp in a sense, putting Bureau in the name does make it sound more authoritative though. It’s not affiliated with the government.
CBP just requires a COO marking. They don’t worry about the specifics, they just want to know where it’s coming from as tariffs and duties will apply and vary depending on the source and article. Though their rules state that it must be there for the ultimate purchaser too, which implies to me that the COO statement must follow FTC rules since they’re the ones providing protections for the ultimate purchaser.
TonyT
Actually, CBP cares a lot about where the value was added, so that companies can’t get around, say, tariffs on Chinese products by simply trans-shipping via Vietnam.
Nathan
I believe some Stihl stuff is made in China and malayasia. Specifically their string trimmer shaft and heads. And most of their attachments for the attachment series. Batteries and all electronics come from somewhere else too.
Not surprising really. But the do also make some items fully in the US. I believe all the engines for Stihl gas products sold in the US are made here.
MM
At least some of their manual tools are rebranded as well. Their long-reach pruner PP-101 and their “Precision Hedge Shear” are both rebranded products from ARS in Japan. I suspect others in their pruning range are too, and they are fantastic.
BrianA
There’s a lot more talk these days about corporate games which prey on uniformed consumers; fees, marketing, shrinkflation, etc. I don’t know if the watchdog groups are more active or we just are more likely to hear about it. While beneficial, I have no sympathy for ignorance or stupidity.
Thankfully Xfinity had to stop using the total BS 10g marketing.
Shouldn’t Stihl have to say Assembled in America using global components like Dewalt?
MM
That’s in the fine print in grey near the bottom of the text box reading “Made in America”, it’s specifically what the asterisk is referring to.
ITCD
DeWalt says Made in America With Global Materials. Because it is, some of the parts are actually made in America, enough to get a pass for the specific claim they make. They make nearly all the motors on-site, the gears are made in America (and assembled into a transmission in Mexico), the plastic shells some are MIUSA some are Mexico, the electronics are obviously imported.
Stihl explains that in the fine print but they, like DeWalt, make some of the parts domestically.
SecretSquirrel
I’d personally put more weight in a tool “Made in Germany” over “Made in America.”
Either way I want to purchase products for all aspects in my life that I know are not made by underpaid or slave labor…
xu lu
If you lie or mislead on one thing, you should assume all other claims are false or misleading. Simply pass on the brand.
Stuart
Intentions matter.
Scott K
This is not meant to defend Stihl’s marketing- but I think there’s a difference between outright lying about where something is manufactured and trying to stretch how much is made in the US. There is definitely something to be said for manufacturers making things here, and it sounds like Stihl was trying to push how far they could use the USA label.
Charles
I don’t think that’s the case. They are a very proud german company and take great pride in making products in America. Somethings are impossible to make in certain places. They go to great lengths to make as much as possible here when it could probably be done somewhere else cheaper. My brother has worked for them for 30yrs They don’t layoff people, they retrain them for something else. He has a tree business on the side and every piece of equipment in the back of his truck is sthil except for the climbing gear.
Scott K
When I was buying my blower, a landscape contractor came in and asked for the biggest stihl pole saw to replace an older one. This is a one off – but I was surprised that he trusted the brand so much to not care about price or other options. He simply wanted the largest Stihl available.
MM
There are a lot of people who feel that way. When I was finishing off college I had a housemate who had previously attended forestry school and worked as a lumberjack in Canada. According to him, there were only two brands that were trusted in that industry: Stihl and Husqvarna, and even then only the professional models. Those were universally accepted as being quality, while everything else was referred to as, and I quote, a baloney cutter.
ITCD
Is it lying or misleading? If there were a good case for that, I would have expected they would have complained to the FTC who can dole out fines and has a lot more power in general. Not the BBB who threatens to turn your A grade into a B+ and that’s it.
Charles
To compare Milwaukee to sthil in the ope segment is a joke. And I’m a Milwaukee fan boy but not ope. I have 20 year old units that I absolutely abuse and everytime I pick them up they run. Rarely have to repair anything.
Jronman
The America terminology is annoying to me. I wish companies referring to only the United States said US, USA, or spelled it out. Also just because something is made with global materials, doesn’t mean that the something is made with junk.
Lynyrd
Sorry, but let’s face it… the general public doesn’t pay attention and many manufacturers suh as Stanley Black & Decker (DeWalt) play on that. “Made In USA – With Global Materials,” or “Assembled In USA,” it’s all Bull$h!#.
Made In USA means Assembled and a minimum of (I believe) 80% of materials sourced/created in USA.
Sorry “Old Man on the porch” – most people don’t care. Harbor Freight (ICON), Gearwrench, and on and on are proving that. After USA, I’d buy Canada or Europe as at least it’s fair labor competition.
I realize personal economics plays a part. I’ll pay double for true Made In USA out of general principle – but, I also realize many starting out in their trades can’t do that, just don’t pretend you’re buying and supporting jobs here at home.
Stuart
It’s not all BS.
Is it sometimes? Absolutely.
Dewalt/SBD? No. When I was at their USA assembly plant, they broke down what’s made where, with a lot of parts sourced from USA factories.
I have also grilled them over the years about what “global materials” mean, and they always have clear and reasonable answers.
A lot of people do care about sourcing, but the question here is about whether Stihl’s claims could send the wrong messages or be interpreted to mean something other than what’s accurate.
Consider a steel tool box that’s manufactured in the USA. The drawers slides and maybe the casters might be imported. But the tool box is built, finished, and then assembled and inspected here.
What are they supposed to say regarding country of origin? “Made in USA with global materials” or similar seems appropriate to me.
Lynyrd
Yes, it’s appropriate and legal, but it’s a term that didn’t exist thirty some years’ ago. It was first created as a marketing scheme to bypass the “Made In USA” requirements of the time. I was privy to those discussions with Sears Holdings, SBD at the time or soon after it became commonplace.
Before that, there were always percentages applied to each category, material source and assembly for “Made In USA,” . Assembly includes; built, finish and assembly under those requirements, in relation to your Toolbox example.
As well there are little to no percentages tied to “Made In USA of Global Materials” or “Assembled In USA.”
https://abovethelaw.com/2023/09/enforcing-made-in-usa-claims-is-still-in-fashion-for-the-ftc/
The FTC finalized the Made in USA Labeling Rule on August 13, 2021, providing that a product using a “Made in USA” claim is prohibited unless: 1) final assembly or processing of the product occurs in the United States; 2) all significant processing that goes into the product occurs in the United States; and 3) all or virtually all ingredients or components of the product are made and sourced in the United States.
https://www.ftc.gov/business-guidance/resources/complying-made-usa-standard#statutes
Assembled in USA Claims
A product that includes foreign components may be called “Assembled in USA” without qualification when its principal assembly takes place in the U.S. and the assembly is substantial. For the “assembly” claim to be valid, the product’s last “substantial transformation” also should have occurred in the U.S. That’s why a “screwdriver” assembly in the U.S. of foreign components into a final product at the end of the manufacturing process doesn’t usually qualify for the “Assembled in USA” claim.
Example: A lawn mower, composed of all domestic parts except for the cable sheathing, flywheel, wheel rims and air filter (15 to 20 percent foreign content) is assembled in the U.S. An “Assembled in USA” claim is appropriate.
eddie sky
Look at Apple products. Sometimes its arrogance when I see, “Designed in California. Assembled in China” on the boxes of computers I work with. Its like, California is a country. It is not. And those employers I’ve met from California will tell you, “we like to hire employees from the East coast as they have work ethics…” um what does THAT tell you? Yep.
I always thought Stihl was made in EU. And that its expensive but most counties I know, and my employer, know that their tools are good. A bit exclusive when it comes to repairs/warranty but rarely needed. Personally, I’m a Husqvarna user for saws. But if same price blower or chainsaw/agro implement was provided by either, I would opt for the Stihl.
“a challenge brought by a competing tool brand”… I was like, Ok WHO’s complaining then I read post of it being Milwaukee’s parent..
Looking at the ad, I assumed the “guy buying the tools was ‘made in America’..not the tool”.
Just put, “Designed in Germany, manufactured and assembled globally*” and put *Americas, Asia, Europe.
(ninja’d by Stuart!.. I was eating and typing at lunch…LOL)
BTW, does anyone here reference BBB when looking for tools? Even CR? I mean, you have to sub to Consumer Reports and I don’t trust them anymore. Any magazine with JD Powers ads just tells me, “they pay for to use their award. Extortion for surveys…”
BigTimeTommy
I’d rather have a made in Germany product and tend to avoid made in America products. I only care about the tool being high quality and a good value. If a German company is making something in America I have to assume it’s a cost cutting measure because they can get away with paying American employees next to nothing. Still bizarre to me anyone is looking for products made in the US.
ITCD
Minimum wage in Germany is equivalent to about $10.72USD per hour. Several states have a minimum wage higher than that, and even those that don’t usually it’s a tough sell to get people hired on for manufacturing at prevailing minimum. I work in manufacturing and we start at $16 per hour at where I am which is well over prevailing minimum.
And that’s just raw wages, but not total compensation. It’s wildly varied on what benefits are offered but they do have a cost. Stihl has pension plans and profit-sharing, company match on 401(k), health insurance programs, company-paid life insurance and STD and LTD insurance, among other things like sick pay and paid holidays.