When shopping on Amazon, they will usually show you an alert when there’s a new version of a product, or if there’s a “renewed” version that will save you a couple of dollars.
I had pulled up the listing for Dewalt’s 18V XRP battery 2-pack, and it showed a listing for “Upgraded” batteries.
At first I was confused. Upgraded Dewalt 18V XRP batteries? I then realized that this was the brand name for 3rd party alternate batteries at much lower pricing.
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Amazon is showing advertisements for 3rd party battery packs in the spot where I have become accustomed to seeing new and sometimes renewed/refurbished product version alerts. This strikes me as unusual.
Oh, I’m certain this is just the algorithm delivering related-theme product advertisements, as confirmed by the Ad Feedback link. Still, how strange.
You’ll see different advertisements if you reload the page. This time, there are 3rd party batteries from another brand, promising Extended Run-Time for Your 18V Dewalt Power Tools.
And then there was an advertisement for DC9096 Replacement for Dewalt batteries.
These weren’t the only advertisements I saw on this page – there is also an Ingersoll Rand real tools for real work advertisement promoting their 2235TiMax impact wrench.
Scrolling down a bit, there are sponsored listings featuring 4 star and above 3rd party batteries and adapters. Following that, there is another section of sponsored products related to this item featuring 86 “pages” of groups of 5 product listing tiles (so ~430 products) with the first couple of dozen (at least) featuring 3rd party batteries and chargers said to be Dewalt-compatible. Then, there’s a section of what other items do customers buy after viewing this item, with one being a single pack of the same Dewalt batteries and the other three being “for Dewalt” products from 3rd party brands.
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Scrolling down the page for the single Dewalt 18V battery listing and you’ll see more or less the same.
There is also a compare with similar items section that lists the Dewalt batteries side by side with the replacement for Dewalt options.
Search for Makita battery packs, and you’ll find sponsored listings among the Makita battery SKUs. The Makita 18V 3.0Ah battery 2-pack product listing is a little different, but also has a lot of 3rd party battery offerings featured in sponsored products related to this item and 4 stars and above sponsored sections. Scroll down towards the user reviews, and you’re again faced with a sponsored products related to this item section that features replacement for Makita batteries and chargers, some of them looking very close to the real thing. Scroll past the reviews and there’s another section with what other items do customers buy after viewing this item with three out of four being for 3rd party battery packs, and then a sponsored ad placement for replace for Makita 18V batteries.
Sources:
- Dewalt 18V Battery 2-Pack Product Listing
- Dewalt 18V Battery Product Listing
- Makita 18V Battery 2-Pack Product Listing
See Also: Would You Use Cheaper Off-Brand Cordless Power Tool Batteries?
Here’s a zoomed-out look at the Dewalt 18V battery product page, up until around the part where the review starts.
For the sponsored listings, there are a greater number of product tiles than normal, due to the browser window being set to lower magnification for the sake of being able to capture more vertical space in the screenshot.
Maybe it’s me, but it seems to be a bit much to me. I don’t think I would feel the same about products such as cordless drills, screwdrivers, power tool accessories, or televisions. Off-brand batteries, especially Li-ion or LiPo, make me nervous. I know how much R&D and testing that goes into pro tool brands’ batteries – does the same care go into these far less expensive off-brand batteries?
Andrew
Off-brand replacement batteries aren’t necessarily new, but I don’t think most consumers are aware that they existed until amazon started to get a bunch of them.
Reviews will tell you that they are usually hit or miss quality, but it looks like they’re trying to make people realize there are other “options” out there that won’t cost you over $150 when your battery system goes obsolete. I’d personally still try to find OEM batteries or something reviewed well by several people before buying an off-brand battery.
Stuart
True, but I was surprised to see such a high concentration of sponsored listings for such batteries, first at a location normally used for “there’s a new version” alerts, and then all the way along the page as you scroll down.
Hilton
Off brand as in not the OEM? Why do they brand these as DeWalt though? Surely they can’t do that?
Stuart
These are screenshots of a Dewalt battery product page with off-brand sponsored listings.
As far as I am aware, there is nothing stopping 3rd party brands from saying things like “for Dewalt” or “replacement for Dewalt.” As long as they say “for Dewalt” and not “Dewalt,” there’s not much brands can do to object. You’ll see this in the camera world a lot, with “for Canon,” or “for Sony.”
Hilton
Thanks Stuart, thought this was the 3rd party listing. Interesting though.
SurvivalSpec
I purchased a 9.0 Ah off-brand battery for Makita since Makita won’t make a 9.0 Ah battery. It’s worked fine for months but buyers must research off-brand companies to compare value and quality. All are from China though, that’s the only consistent among the off-brands. Look for the maker name such as Vanon, TenMore, Waitley, VANNTECH etc. No off-brand will match the quality of the original manufacturer though.
With that said, Amazon should make sellers put the manufacturer’s name at the top and first mention before the actual brand of tool they were designed for. It gets confusing to some especially when you’re looking at the appearance of the batteries online.
Gordon
You also risk the company using the cache of good reviews to suddenly tank quality and cash in. Amazon is particularly dangerous in this regard because sellers can reuse old listings with completely unrelated reviews.
PETE
You can always use fakespot.com to help discern some of the mud.
MarylandUSA
Gordon isn’t referring to fake reviews. He’s referring to reviews of a different, highly rated product that used to occupy the same link, or to an earlier version of a product that was made to a higher standard of quality.
Jared
Do you have a way of checking the Ah rating for your battery? I’ve looked at off-brand batteries before but always concluded it wasn’t worth the risk for the marginal savings. One of the common complaints I’ve seen is people saying the off-brand battery works but doesn’t last as long as the comparably -sized OEM version.
That makes me think many are being built with the external form factor of a certain size of battery and wear that label, but perhaps the manufacturers are substituting lower-capacity cells. E.g. 18650 cells might be 600-3,400 mah. So if the knockoff uses 600mah cells but Dewalt uses 1200, then that “5ah” badged knockoff battery might just be an extra-huge 2.5ah pack.
Stuart
Cheap and easy way: Find a constant-output source, such as an LED worklight, set it to low, and measure the runtime for a battery of good health and known capacity, and then a battery of unknown capacity.
Lab testing: Use an electronic load, input some settings, and run a battery charge capacity program.
MtnRanch
I agree. I test batteries and have no problem sending them back to Amazon at their expense if they don’t come close to what I’ve measured on the the genuine article.
Chris
Ever wonder why an off-brand/aftermarket won’t match OEM?
Popgun42
I have been looking for a M12 battery sale and notices the off brands. I would not buy, some. bad reviews…
Walker
I have had a 2 ah M12 knockoff for a couple years now. Use it on a weekly basis, not terribly heavy use though. I believe the brand was Flinkytek.
Ken
I know someone who works in the ad placement industry and describes the process as companies bidding for that ad space, using software that decides the cost of the ad in less than a microsecond. He says you are like like to see more and more of this type of ad substitution in the future, not less. while the software can figure out generally what’s relevant to you, it can’t figure out that you don’t want fake batteries and prefer brand-name ones.
Denny Sawyer
I’ve been using the off brand 4AH batteries in my Ryobi string trimmer for over a year now and they hold a charge longer than the OEM battery. I’ve also been using the off brand batteries in a Hitachi drill and in a Makita drill with no problems. Just read the reviews carefully (I pay more attention to the 4-star reviews than the 5-star because they’re less likely to be fake) and make sure you check the return policy and you’ll be okay.
Wayne R.
You’d think there’d be a huge opportunity for someone to bring organization, guarantees and high expectations to the entirety of rechargeable cells and the batteries made from them. Tesla might be in the best position, but maybe others – Panasonic, Sanyo, Duracell, etc. – could do better.
As it is now, it’s just “China”, and the trend is negative.
aerodawg
I bought a couple DeWalt off brands. Took one apart just to see what it was like. Seemed to be pretty well assembled and had what appeared to be Samsung cells inside. No way to verify that as good as the Chicoms are at fakes. They seem to work just as well or better than my DeWalt branded batteries….
Evadman
Those advertisements are not from amazon directly, they are from the seller of the product. Companies can pay to put their product in those spots. it is a per impression and per click process, where you can say ‘spend $1k to put my product there, max of $5 each sale’, and amazon will determine who wins at a specific point in time for a specific consumer (or someone that isn’t logged in, which is cheaper).
Source: I have a 3rd party seller account with amazon, and I have those options for ad placement for ‘similar products’. There’s a lot of onus put on the company doing the advertising to follow the rules.
Jp
I’ve used fake m12, m18, and craftsman. Sometimes with success, other times burned by defective crap. They work well enough when income is limited. But I’d never go back now. No tool damage, no fires for me. Back then I didn’t know there was so much science going into batteries. I thought it was all a RIP off. I know better now.
Lightheaded
Amazon has been under scrutiny for several years selling Chinese fake items. The count is up to 4000 items currently. Google “Amazon fake items” for page after page of credible articles. I have been the victim myself a half dozen times at least. The latest being a health supplement for my dog. It had almost identical label and sold by third party for $50, usually $70. Lithium ion batteries can release tremendous amounts of current if not protected properly or using a faked brand name charger. I still use Amazon but only for something that probably won’t harm me. Also purchased Chinese branded 3/4 inch oak plywood from HD. My eyes and lungs burned from sawdust. NEVER AGAIN.
JoeM
I’ve been noticing it more often as well, here in Canada. Only, they still have the “Upgraded Version” show up as well. If there’s no upgraded version, it’s an ad for another item. That box seems to be permanently stuck on “Sell them SOMETHING, ANYTHING!” rather than just “There’s an Upgrade for that!”
But, it does bother me quite a bit, when you go searching for something specific, and they flood you with everything BUT what you’re looking for. If I still HAD my old 14.4V DeWALT drill, I’d definitely consider the cheaper knock-offs, considering how expensive a single battery for those became. But as long as I have an active line, I will buy the originals for it. Expensive? Yes. But at least they’re supported. It would just be nice if, despite Capitalism being what it is, places like Amazon didn’t shove hundreds of alternatives in your face. At least if I want to filter them out in a SEARCH I just have to click the “Prime” filter, and only the originals show up, no sponsored or marketplace items.
This is a little like looking at a Home Depot display, seeing the battery you intend to buy, and the second your hand crosses a point on the display, an arm pulls it away, revealing a banner for their house brand batteries instead. And you can’t actually get the arm to come back out until you have at least taken some sort of tag off the banner to prove you’ve read and considered it. I know that is ridiculous, and completely unrealistic, but it’s the best metaphor I could think of for what Amazon is doing for that sales box these days.
I’m already paying for Prime, can’t I get a little space between my shopping, and their ads? Even just a LITTLE BIT?
Lightheaded
Latest link to Amazon woes
https://abc7chicago.com/shopping/report-amazon-struggling-to-stay-on-top-of-recalled-items-counterfeits-/5493664/
Garrick
Amazon used be a bargain hunter’s paradise when they weren’t making profits. We had to be careful, especially with third party sellers. We still have to be careful, if not more so now, but the prices (especially on Amazon Canada) are premium. I now only use it for things I absolutely need, but can’t find elsewhere.
Third party tool batteries have always snuck into my searches almost from the time lithium ion started powering tools.
Shawn
If more people ignored these garbage knock offs we wouldn’t be inundated with ads. Don’t buy them. Respect your tools
JoeM
I agree with the second part, but unfortunately the first part is wrong. Amazon has been changing that box from a suggestion to upgrade ad, to a “Sell Anything You Can” ad.
No, we shouldn’t be buying the knock-offs unless our tools are truly EOL and too expensive to buy the batteries for. Yes, respect for your tools by buying the original batteries for them is probably one of the easiest ways to maintain your tools.
Unfortunately, we’re getting the ads because these third party sellers, marketplace sellers, and exclusive product sellers, all buy “Ad Space” from Amazon. So, when there’s no upgrade for a tool to be sold in that spot, we will continue to get ads from the third parties. It isn’t limited to just the batteries, it’s happening system-wide now. At least 80-90% of all Amazon Canada pages have a Sponsored or Sale box where the Upgrade Available box used to be. And it used to be ONLY for new versions of tools before. Now it’s Ad Space for Amazon, and Third Party Vendors.
It’s a minor gripe, to be sure. But, just confirming we’re on the same page here. You’re totally right otherwise.
Lightheaded
Amazon is now FULL of Monkey Business (algorithms devoted to…..$$$?) They are “enhance shareholder profit” above all . Results vary but ?
KK
I will not buy Chinese batteries ever, ah the amount is less than stated. + The batteries have poor quality cells and give less power out.
Vards Uzvards
Never say never again! I just checked a few Ryobi batteries, and some Hitachi ones – all are made in China. I would guess Milvaukee batteries are manufactured in China too. (Bosch 12V batteries are made in Malaysia though.)
ToolGuyDan
I don’t buy off-brand batteries for my expensive tools, either, but this whole discussion seems to ignore the possibility of just swapping out the cells in the packs you already own. You can get prime-quality cells for a fraction of the cost of even a knockoff pack, and installing them only takes 15 minutes and basic skills.
Jacob Kleinsasser
There are some tools out there when you disconnect the battery cells to replace them. They will brick or lock the circuit board.Which leads me to ask is there a way to prevent this. Like a heart lung machine that keeps a person alive during a heart lung transplant.
CountyCork
For my Thinkpad I’ve actually have had better luck buying good quality generic vs very expensive OEM. That said I can buy cheap OEM Bosch batteries all day on ebay. Many of my originals are already 5 years old and still going strong. Have some of the new core batteries which are even better so no way would I go generic with Bosch 18v.
ktash
I found a couple of places that are reputable sellers of batteries for laptops. The place I use gives a lot of information about what’s in the batteries. Since the old laptop is worth less than a new oem battery, I’ve gotten these for at least 5 years and have had good luck. I had one that didn’t seem right and the seller took it right back with no shipping charges on my part.
That said, I’d never get anything but oem batteries for tools.
ktash
Amazon is a mess! For many things, the big box stores have comparable prices and easier return policies.
Mopar4wd
I have been using an off brand Ryobi Nicad for about 3 years now. Still works fine. I also have 18V Dewalt one. Also works fine at about 2 years old. Given alot of these batteries run similar cells I’m not to worried about it.
KevinB
good to know,I’ve been looking at some of those some of those Ryobi nicads as a cheap alternative, the Ryobi lith ions seem to crap out on me for no reason after about 14 months. I have bosch & milwaukee lith ions going on 5 years still working great.
Doug Lough
All of this could be solved if OEM batteries were sold at a reasonable price. I understand its an accessory profit item. But by making them affordable would knock out the knock offs. I would pay more for OEM if it wasn’t triple the price of the off brands. That being said I have had both OEM and off brands go bad. OEM last longer and off brand last longer. But in general I do like the OEM’s better.
Doug Lough
And….the OEM’s and the knock offs are all made in China. Some in the same factory.
Stuart
Is this an assumption or have you ever seen evidence of this?
Just because OEM and off-brand accessories look similar, that doesn’t mean they’re made at the same factory or from the same parts.
Django
Its a really common practice in china for knockoff products to be “third shifts” as most factories and contracts run on a 2 shifts 6 days a week schedule, and if you have willing workers and are willing to take a risk they will make knockoffs, but other come from factories who paid for tooling but then never got the contract.
Stuart
Hitachi/Metabo HTP have priced some of their batteries aggressively low, with their 3.0Ah battery being the best example, but there are still off-brand replacement options on Amazon.