The question of 12V Max vs. 18V or 20V Max has come up a lot, and I’ve had different takes on the topic over the years. A good question came in, presenting a
Matthew wrote:
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I’m pretty new to power tools, only recently got out of the Army and I’m making a huge career change to organic farming, opening my own small scale farm over the next two years. Experience with new beehives, carpentry projects, and rain barrel spouting is demonstrating my need to rapidly expand my power tool arsenal beyond the handful of generic brand items passed down from my father.
Going by your site I’m guessing my skill level is pretty new and my projects are (and mostly will be) more of the DIY or generic domestic categories than anything specialized. I also recognize the point you make multiple times on different posts about buying into a brand to streamline compatibility. My serious questions are:
1) How do I identify the best class & brand of equipment for my needs, so that I’m not wasting money on 18V items when a 12V version would suffice or vice versa?
2) How do I identify the brand with the best durability & cost-effectiveness for my skill level, budget and needs?
Good luck, Matthew! And I hope my commentary and reader feedback still reaches you in time to make a difference. I’m sorry for the delaying in getting back to you on this.
How to Identify the Best Class and Brand of Tools for Your Needs
I have been more and more leaning towards recommending 18V and 20V Max cordless power tools, unless there are budgetary considerations or other factors that would result in 12V Max tool recommendations.
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Consider this – when comparing 12V Max and 18V or 20V Max cordless power tools, the larger and more powerful tools can almost always do the jobs of the smaller tools, but the reverse is rarely true.
(As an aside, 18V and 20V Max is the same thing, with the difference being marketing language.)
18V and 20V Max tools present power, performance, and often runtime benefits. 12V Max tools present user experience benefits. Milwaukee’s M12 band saw can be used with one hand, and overhead. Their M12 Fuel rotary hammer is more lightweight and compact compared to full-sized models.
The best approach is to identify needs and plan accordingly, although it’s not always going to work out perfectly.
It also doesn’t have to be mutually exclusive. Some brands, such as Milwaukee, Dewalt, and now Bosch, have dual-voltage chargers, where you can recharge 12V and 18V class power tool batteries on the same charger. This makes it easier to have a mix of 12V and 18V class tools.
It’s a gamble.
But also consider that your business needs might change or evolve over time. A heavy duty 18V drill might power through all your heavy duty drilling tasks, but might be a burden for when you need to drill dozens or hundreds of small diameter holes. Or that 12V drill might be lightweight and compact, but might struggle to efficiently drill many medium-diameter holes. Or maybe the 3/8″ chuck is too small to handle larger hole saw arbors.
If in your shoes, I would start with 18V-class tools and then consider complementing them with 12V-class tools if or when clear benefits presented themselves.
How to Identify the Brand with the Best Durability & Cost-Effectiveness for My Skill Level, Budget and Needs?
This is a tougher one.
Most pro-grade brands have repair networks that can help you get a worn, damaged, or defective tool back to working condition. You could ask around to see which brands have good turnaround, but results might vary regionally. This is something to keep in mind, but I haven’t heard enough good or bad about any one brand to affect my own purchasing decisions.
To start off, you should do some research, if you hadn’t already, perhaps finding farm-related forums, and see what kinds of tools you might need but have not considered. Metal shears, for instance?
Make a list of the tools you need, and then try to think about what you might need in the next 5 years. Prioritize the tools if you can.
For me, a compact drill is the highest priority, followed by a multi-speed brushless impact driver. Who makes the best compact drill? (Dewalt, in my opinion.) The best multi-speed impact? (Hitachi.)
Do you want a quieter impact tool, such as the Milwaukee M18 Surge hydraulic driver? If so, then your options are limited. Dewalt and Bosch, for instance, don’t make anything similar.
Cost-effectiveness? Many pro brands are fiercely competitive when it comes to price. There are also premium brands that might cost more, but sometimes in return for giving you more or compromising less.
Yesterday when looking into rotary polishers, I came across the topic of general and universal manufacturing, and specialty manufacturing.
A tool that’s designed for general or universal applications might be versatile and capable of handling a wide range of tasks. Specially manufactured tools might be less versatile, but might be better for tackling specific tasks or applications.
Take the new Metabo sheet metal and pilot hole drill, for example. It’s a low torque and high speed drill designed for specific applications.
My recommendation would be that you start off with the brand that best fulfills your top needs, and to keep an open mind when it comes to future expansion. Since it sounds like you’ll be working out of a fixed location, as opposed to traveling around with a tool bag, it shouldn’t be too much of an inconvenience to buy into different brands’ cordless power tool platforms.
Yes, maintaining multiple cordless power tool platforms will cost more, but if you do it for the right reasons it’ll pay off in the form of saved time or effort.
On the subject of budget, there are different tiers of tool brands. Since you plan to use the tools for business, I would suggest sticking with a pro-grade brand, at least for your essential tools. That’s not to say that lower tiers of tools aren’t good, but I wouldn’t trust them as much for mission-critical work.
Shopping between different brands at the same tier, such as Dewalt vs. Milwaukee, is not going to be a huge difference when you factor in the cost of a couple of tools. Both brands have regular promos, so you’ll definitely want to look at those.
See – I meant it when I said this is a tough question. It’s tough when someone comes to me with a list of their tool needs and preferences, tougher when there are more unknowns.
What tools would you guys recommend for Matthew and his planned small farming needs?
Pete
For a farm? 18v all the way. Theres NO WAY i’d consider a 12v for a farm. Your always fixing something and not having a impact wrench would suck or full size sawzall or a full size drill…
Mike McCarthy
I disagree, I am a commercial electrician, I use the m12 fuel drill, impactor, and recip saw with the 4 amp hour batteries. These tools have made my life a lot easier. I can cut 4 inch holes with the drill, I often use 1 3/8 uni bits with the drill. The impactor will drive 4 inch screws, and the recipe is more than powerful enough to cut unistrut, conduit, and blocking. todays 12 volt tools are more than capable for a diy or commercial user. Don’t write off the little tools, just buy smart.
Bremon
I have an M12 Fuel Hackzall, and an M18 Fuel Sawzall. Tearing down an old shed or fence on the farm with the Hackzall? No thanks. 5/8″ stroke compared to 1 1/8″ is pretty notable, though the Hackzall works great for conduit. Likewise, 3″ construction screws are nothing for the M12 Fuel impact, but it doesn’t hit like an M18 so getting into longer screws or small lags it drives slower and impacts more.
jtr165
My only experience with 12v vs. 18/20v directly was replacing/building a deck last summer at my home. I have a fairly decent assortment of Dewalt’s XR and brushed 20v stuff, while a friend has a lot of 12v Fuel tools.
When we were slicing off hundreds of board feet of old PT painted lumber, through thousands of nails, there was zero debate about the need for a bigger sized recip and CS. The smaller M12 could do it, but shorter stroke was rendering blades useless in no time, and overheating batteries faster than my brushed 20v. Same with the 5 3/8’s circular saw; it could do it with an aggressive demo blade, but the sustained running of cross cutting larger chunks of the decking would make him wait 15 minutes before being able to charge. It was enough that he borrowed the neighbor’s corded equipment before lunch.
I used 3.5″ deck screws for all of the new deck planks, and the m12 drill vs. 20v XR was less noticeable. The 12v tool was fine for deep pilots, and wasn’t heating the drill up by any noticeable degree…but running the screws with impacts was nearly a 2:1 comparison. The smaller impact would take about twice as long with twice as many impacts, and half the battery life because of it. Neither were ‘struggling’, but it added up after several hundred screws were installed. Worth noting; all of this work was done over a weekend with temps in the 90’s throughout most of it.
I’m not in any way comparing brands. Dewalt’s 12v line is kind of laughable still, and being a DIY’er I probably would’ve went with a smaller nominal figure tool set initially, but my local Lowes had a huge deal a few years ago on a 20v XR drill and driver, and i’ve stuck with the platform ever since. In the case of that deck, the difference was pretty noticeable, and I’d strongly bet the same differences would be there with any 12v vs 18v comparison on bigger jobs. For smaller and quicker projects, the extra cost, and weight, of bigger stuff is wasted…and judging where a new buyer falls with that is almost impossible.
Electricguy
Commercial work is more forgiving than residential or industrial. You’re mostly dealing with thin metals and light mortar work. For a farm 18v would make more sense not just for power, but for versatility in tools. He’ll likely be dealing with wood more and that’s more taxing on the tools.
Nathan
I’d have to second this. I bought into the M12 line for portability, weight and price considerations, but i spent time helping out on the family farm growing up and they regularly push the power limits of tools. It would be silly to start with anything but the largest sized lineup.
Nathan
As far as brand goes, you might consider starting with ryobi. It’s in no way the same quality as Milwaukee (it’s the bottom of the three-tier lineup of Ryobi/Rigid/Milwaukee positioned by the same company for different price points), but it’s inexpensive and you don’t have to worry so much about a tool getting left out in the rain, burned up from over- or misuse, or stolen. Farm tools are a whole different use case than metropolitan handyman tools and inexpensive “disposable” tools aren’t a bad idea in those kind of conditions and uses.
MichaelHammer
I couldn’t agree more. I always recommend Ryobi to DIYers. I invested in Milwaukee brushless because I use them all day every day. Brushless is unnecessary for DIY, although pretty much every brand has gone to it. Rigid is a good option as well (lifetime guarantee, even on batteries). And while doling out advice, let me share a lesson learned: if you are working alone, it is completely unnecessary to own more than three batteries. This tip will save you a bunch of cash.
(As an aside, 10.8V and 12V max is the same thing. The only difference is marketing language. )
Bremon
18v/20v Max all the way. 12v is oriented towards a homeowner who plans to do extremely little, or specialty tools that are comparably priced to 18v for a tradie who knows exactly what they want/need and are looking to lighten up their boxes.
18v lineups are the jack of all trades with the widest range of tools available. Farm tools? Drill, impact, circular saw, Sawzall, impact wrench, and maybe a grinder. What you could use from there will be determined by what you do yourself and the size of your operation. Those 6 tools will be versatile for a wide range of DIY build and repair tasks.
Adam
That is not how they decided what markets the tools go towards. It would be better to classify based on abuse. The Dewalt 12v is still a pro’s tool, and is built for the abuse. Now, I would say Milwaukee M12 is a better 12v line for a pro that the Dewalt with all their extra offerings.
Nobody considers B&D 18/20v line or Ryobi 18v to be ‘pro tools’ even though they are 18v. Go to a works site, and those a pro-tools. Go into people’s middle-America garages, and you will see home-owner lines.
I’m not a full farm , but deal enough with field work and the similar. I would not consider 12v as your first line of tools. There will be a time when you need a 1/2″ impact, and 12v won’t have the option. I find myself using a lot of Milwaukee’s lighting solutions for early or late work. That might be something to consider.
I know what I said about B&D, but they do make a 4-gallon backpack sprayer that works great. Only reason I have that battery platform. We are buying a 2nd one so we can leave a dedicated solution in one of them. So much nicer than gas offerings. ~$125 on zoro after a coupon last year. best purchase of the year
Bremon
A 12v Bosch, Makita or Milwaukee will take abuse. They won’t do much serious work. 12v Dewalt is a waste of time; a line that’s aging and gets no attention from SBD.
As I said; there are pro tools in 10.8/12v but they are for pros who want to lighten up their boxes or use small specialty tools geared towards plumbing or electrical.
Brushed M12 drill? I guess you could install some cabinet doors with it. But serious work? Get real. 12v Milwaukee Fuel still has way more plastic in the powertrain than an M12 Fuel does.
Art
M12 Drill/Impact has a nice motor but it’s heavy. I might as well get a 18v. Look at the dimensions and weight. Specially the Drill, i would buy 18v since they make them pretty compact.
The yeti
Bosch or dewalt I guess . Bosch has nicer stuff for the most part. But dewalt makes a lot more products and is somewhat American built .
casey
if you will be fixing things, also consider down the road the mac tools impact wrench here fits the 20v dewalt batteries. I picked this up as I already have many 20v batteries and tools.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/252737513525
great for busting off lugnuts and automotive work. the hog ring was worn when I got it but went to a air tool service shop and got one for $1 and its good as new. I have loaned it out a few times to friends working on their cars and I can take it to the junk yard, way better than an impact driver for nut busting power.
i have the 12v drill and driver, they mostly just sit on my work bench when I need to take small screws out or do some small work. I have drilled some large holes with the drill and drove some 3″ lag bolts but felt like I would kill the tool if I did that all day. IIRC, I only got them because I was able to work out a trade for them for some stuff I did not need. its nice that they are light, but the run time and power is not there. 20v is my go to for everything now.
you can usually find at least a few sets on the local craigslist of hardly used sets for cheaper as well.
Statler
or you could buy the dewalt 20v impact gun, which is the same thing except with yellow plastic instead of orange
Chapin
Good luck on the farming, Matthew! I’ve benefited immensely from the info here on Toolguyd, so here’s hoping I can give back a bit of helpful info!
I too am something of a homesteader/small farmer, and agree with you and the other commenter that there’s always something to fix, and having the right tools can make the difference between a timely solution and utter frustration.
I have gradually upgraded to Milwaukee tools and am extremely satisfied with them. I got a 12 volt drill and hacksaw kit on sale some time ago, and they are really handy for grabbing to run put a few screws in somewhere or cut a pipe or small board, etc. Very lightweight and portable.
However, I agree with Pete that if your going to have one set it ought to be an 18V. The extra power and versatility will save your day sooner or later. I have the Milwaukee Fuel hammer drill, impact, Sawzall, and grinder, and they are all great and can handle about anything you throw at them.
If your budget is a bit lower and your usage isn’t real heavy at this point you could start with one of Milwaukee’s lower priced drill sets (brushed or brushless). Since all batteries, chargers and tools in Milwuakee’s 18V line-up are compatible, you can upgrade or add tools as you need them and still use all your existing stuff.
Hope this helps!
Chapin
Wanted to mention Milwaukee’s great lighting line-up as well, from the M12 flashlights and lanterns up to the M18 worklights that can also be plugged into 110, they are great, and farmers seem to always be needing to do something in dark corners at odd hours of the night!
Tom
18/20 is clearly the right answer.
Brand – Get a good combo. Whatever major brand has a good deal at the time. Don’t overthink it – there are many great choices (Milwaukee, Dewalt, Bosch, Makita or maybe Hitachi or Rigid).
For a small farm, I’d start with Drill, Impact, Recip, Circular kit at a minimum. Depending on your work habits – maybe a lighting solution too.
ca
I used to work on a large farm. Definitely get 18/20V because there is a larger/better range of tools, including more specialty tools like high torque impact wrenches and grease guns. I think you’d eventually regret getting 12 V tools since some tasks do require more power.
casey
also, get a brand you can run a oscillating multitool, I am always finding new uses for it, more so I am sure if I had a farm. I love my dewalt brushless version, one of the better ones out there.
Joe Hanson
I would first look at Dewalt, Milwaukee, or Bosch for my most used tools in your situation but pick one brand. Hitachi is stepping up their game recently but their future is currently uncertain. Next for seldom used but needed tools i would consider having a second brand, probably Ryobi because their tools are decent and they have a vast selection of tools at a good price. Wait for Father’s day or the Thanksgiving/Christmas shopping season if you can. The tools you need and the best deals going on at the time could make your choice clear. Id stick with 18v/20v max first. Later on you can decide on 12v should the need arise but 12v is usually more for space/comfort on specific tasks that you know won’t need as much power.
Joe Hanson
Ridgid is not a bad option either if they have the core tools you need but their selection isnt as nice as a pro brand. Remember where you can, buy corded tools for work you can do in a shop or garage because they will outlive your cordless tools. If you need to make a couple short cuts out in the field, don’t be afraid to use a hand saw. They arent very expensive plus they are quiet.
Chris
go with 20v max. There is a wider selection of tools than the 12v max. I like dewalts tools. There extremely tough tools and will last you a while.
John Blair
The tradeoffs between 12v and 18v are more questions of speeds than capabilities on the bread and butter tools. My Bosch 12v impact can drive a 4 inch lag bolt into pine. It just takes forever and the battery doesn’t last as long. My 12v Reciprocating Saw is fine when all I need to do is cut a board or two, but when it comes time to remodel, I pull out the 18v every time. But when I am assembling cabinets, putting anchors in drywall or working over my head, I prefer the small size of the 12v systems.
As for brands, for 12v I consider there to only be two choices, Milwaukee and Bosch. Milwaukee has a larger selection and some nifty speciality tools (especially for plumbers) but they tend to be bigger (which minimizes the benefit of the 12v for me). Bosch is smaller and less expensive and I can tell you they last in spite of the abuse I throw at them.
For 18v, Dewalt and Milwaukee. Dewalt is generally less expensive and if you are not in a rush seems to run 25 off 100 every year (which makes it great for buying bare tools). Once again Milwaukee has some nice speciality tools but the pricing tends to make them for people who make their living with tools. For me, I started with a drill/driver and impact combo, then when the 25 off 100 rolled around, added some bare tools. Now I own just about every Dewalt 20v max tool. The tools I use most often are the impact driver, the 20v vac, led area light and the oscillating tool.
You don’t need to worry about durability with the Bosch, Dewalt or Milwaukee products. They are all reliable for the tools you are looking at.
If you actually use the tools, you aren’t locked into the battery platform if you find something you really want on another platform. For myself, I purchased a cordless Ryobi 18 gauge nail gun (with battery less expensive and lighter than Milwaukee and Dewalt models), an inflater (I hate hand pumps) and a cordless glue gun.
But building the tools you need really involves knowing what capabilities you will use and when you will need them. If you work sales, you can buy a great selection of tools over a couple of years and not break the bank. Avoid buying tools you will only use once (unless you would like to buy a rarely used Milwaukee M12 caulking gun, then call me). Also deals aren’t deals if the tool sucks (Milwaukee M12 vac, I am looking at you).
Austin werrmann
As a pro I have both 12 and 18v but for most he owners and diy people 12v will suffice. Especially if you get a top of the line 12v tool like the m12 fuel
Bird Legs
You nailed the answer right there in the article when you said, “…start with 18V-class tools and then consider complementing them with 12V-class tools…”
Perfect answer farm or Brooklyn.
fred
No farm experience – other than visiting mostly as a kid. But we did a lot of farmhouse revamps , a few barn conversions etc. My business was a bit varied in that there were 3 distinct businesses. In the general contracting part – most of the crews gravitated toward using 18V tools – and we had started and stayed with Makita LXT tools. More recently – my ex-compatriots have been doing some migration to Milwaukee. We had what we called installers – working out of our cabinet shop – who used a lot more Milwaukee M12 tools. In a separate business – our plumbers also seemed to rely more on M12 tools – but had some M18 tools as well. In the pipe and metal fabrication business – use of cordless tools was very limited – mostly for shop maintenance tasks.
Thinking about what chores might crop-up (pun intended) on a farm – I would think 18V tools would offer your best options – and one possible way to decide on a brand would be to look at the lineup currently available to see what is on your check list now and possibly down the road. When we bought in – that’s how we decided on Makita – but since that time Milwaukee and Dewalt have expanded their lines quite a bit. In alphabetical order – you might look at Bosch, Dewalt, Makita and Milwaukee – possibly looking at things like their cordless garden tools as well – for times when an engine-driven tool might be less advantageous.
Regarding servicing and proximity to a service center – in my experience that was a big deal when considering corded tools – but we found that quite a few cordless tools were deemed unserviceable when they failed – at least at a reasonable cost versus buying new. You may still want to check out warranties and service centers.
Mike
I’d go with 20v/18v I rather have more power then less, plus some compact 20/18 v models are just as small and light as 12v models especially the new Makita compact drill and drive
alex
Agreed. We are seeing more and more 18/20v tools coming up that are as compact as their 12V version. I was looking to buy into a 12v lineup the other day and I tried the 12v Milwaukee fuel drill. Boy this thing is as heavy as my compact Dewalt 20v drill and the price is around the same. So I don’t see any reason why I should get it.
If I were you, I would choose a 18v/20v platform. Also, bear in mind that some higher voltage tools are starting to appear (flexvolt 60V, makita 36v, …) so I will really consider that before investing in a new tools line up. These may come in handy one day especially on a farm.
In my case, I got the Dewalt 20v max tools as my main platform. I plan to own some flexvolt tools as well one day for some heavier duty tasks but I don’t need them right now. I own no 12v tool because I really see no size advantage versus the new compact 18/20v tools. Plus, they aren’t really cheaper than their 18/20v counterparts. I also got the Dewalt 8v screwdriver which is great when assembling furnitures or doing some electrical work. Would love to see more tools on the 8v platform for very light duty applications or some metering tools.
Joe
Makita makes a huge line of pro tools…Milwaukee is a great brand and a huge line of tools..can’t go wrong with either…but,,,I’m a Dewalt guy,,,big line of 18v tools ,a cordless power station that may come in handy on a farm, and the most powerful line of cordless tools equal too or more powerful than corded……Flexvolt…..
..Also Dewalt makes a semipro line of outdoor equipment for 18v and a pro line at 40v………The future of Flexvolt looks amazing. It may replace every corded tool ever made…….One more thing ..Ryobi is a fantastic,great line of tools for a budget minded guy…I have both lines of tools …..
Tom
I used 12v tools and have only encountered one time that they couldn’t get the job done. I needed to drill a 6 inch hole for a vent stack. My 3/8 chuck just couldn’t handle that.
I really like the size of 12v tools. I can use my little impact to drive screws into 2x4s all day long. The only downside is the noise on the impact driver.
processwrench
Something else to think about is Outdoor Power Equipment (OPE) such as trimmers, chainsaws, blowers and polesaws and how it ties into whatever product line you are thinking of buying into. For most home owners the newer 18v class OPE’s can do the job, but for small farm work i’d think you’d need 36v and up. And if you want to stick with one battery that narrows it down to Dewalt Flexvolt and Makita. Makita also has the 18v sub compact drill and driver that’s lightweight like a 12v. Flexvolt has some seriously interesting tools such as table saws and portable power stations. If you decide you need sprayers (yes organic farming still sprays things) the only brand that has them is ryobi but their 40v line is a completely different battery than the 18v line.
Blythe M
For farm tasks you’ll be much happier with the extra power of 18v. I have both, and if I could only have one it would definitely be the 18v just for the piece of mind that I’m not limited.
Plus, 18v give you the option to use your batteries with OPE tools also if you desire(blower, weed wacker, chainsaw, etc)
RX9
Some tools work best within the 12v form factor and others are more well served by 18/20v platforms.
The best 12v applications are ones where compact size and maneuverability are of paramount importance. These often include diagnostic equipment and detail tools which do not require significant amounts of power.
The applications most geared to higher voltage include tools that not only use a lot of power, but are not in any way hampered by the larger battery size.
Suited to 12v:
-Rotary tool (Dremel)
-Screwdriver
-One handed reciprocating saw
-Inspection camera
-IR thermometers
-Voltage meters
-Ratchet
-Engraver
Suited to 18v and higher:
-SDS Rotary hammer (esp. SDS Max)
-Miter Saw
-Full size impact wrench
-Full size circular saw
-Angle Grinder
-All outdoor power equipment
-Air compressor
fred
Some of these 12V tools (meters and instruments) probably are just as useful being powered by appropriate alkaline batteries. Others like SDS Max rotohammers and angle grinders – benefit from brushless technology and at least 18V batteries – with some applications pushing it. We had concrete and rock breaking jobs – where our mantra was don’t use a SDS rotohammer when you need a pneumatic jackhammer and the jackhammer needs to be set aside when you need a hoe ram or should call in the rock drillers and blasters.
Mike McFalls
Makita all the way. Yes they are at the top of the price spectrum- but that is where the negatives end.
Makita offers 150 tools on the 18v LXT platform. Further, their 18x X2 LXT tools operate on 2 – 18v batteries for 36v of total power. This is a significant advantage over other tools lines as you won’t need separate batteries when you need more power.
The dual batteries is no small deal. As recently evaluated on another site:
“For Milwaukee’s 9.0 amp hour battery and DeWalt’s FlexVolt 3.0/9.0 amp hour battery, you get a solid 162 watt hours. With Makita 18V X2 LXT tools, you can take it to a total of 216 watt hours – a full 33% more capacity than those two options”
Also Makita offers a dual charger and is known forthe fastest charging times on their batteries.
Good luck with the farm and thanks for your service!
Bremon
You also need to own more batteries and chargers to keep up with the demand of X2 tools; reciprocating saw and circular saw especially. That new rear-handle saw looks fantastic though.
Aaron Rhodes
Makita has the fastest charge. I may be imagining things but it seems to come at the price of battery failure rates. Their 1.5ah batteries were so bad we had to stop buying them and still replaced way more 3ah then comparable Milwaukee batteries. It may not have been the fast charging as much as the batteries or tools but I tended to lean towards the charger.
Matt
I think your the niche customer that ridgid was targeting and perhaps still targets although the gen5xgear they are releasing now does have a more professional hue…
Theyre relatively inexpensive ( very affordable when compared to higher end m18 fuel, DeWalt FV, Hilti etc) they have a great line up of heavy duty tools( from grinders and saws to impact wrenches and cordless nailers) and they’re not at all complex, very easy to use and understand with excellent ergonomics and power.
Also, next to Hilti, they represent one of the best warranties out there.
Couple all of this with their availability and, AND, a decent 12v kit offering whick would make a great supplement to any Gen5x kits(brushed or brushless) …..I think you really couldn’t go wrong with Ridgid
Cr8on
18/20… Anything less is um,…. Less. For a look into pro tools only and then look at DeWalt(very available at most farm stores) Milwaukee, Bosch and Makita, as they all offer an extremely wide range of tools. I’m all in for yellow and make my living with them.
skfarmer
i vote for 20v max dewalt stuff. plenty of variety in the lineup and the compact batteries and compact tools do heavy work in a near 12 volt size package. you can add heavier tools if and when needed as well as larger capacity batteries. a bonus is that the 20v max chargers will work on 12 volt dewalt if you decide you need smaller tools. add an 18-20 volt adapter and there are piles of older dewalt 18 volt tools on secondary market that may be picked up at a lower cost. i don’t believe any other mfg has the compatability between platforms.
Alan
I’d go 18V/20V for general use, only 12V line worth considering is M12. I’m a fabricator for a small defense contractor, and I use M12 Fuel stuff for the majority of tasks. My 20V Dewalts only get used maybe 10% of the time. The point I’m making is 12V is a little more specialized, also good for shaving weight and saving your joints when you have to use a tool all day.
mattd
I am sad that so few people mentioned Makita. Overall I like their tools more than Dewalt and Milwaukee, they have a HUGE lineup, and they are very durable. they are also very self serviceable. They also have niche tools like their 18v sub compacts, so you can get a 12v weight without having to have different batteries.
JoeM
I say invest. My budget is extremely low, and I can’t afford for my tools to fail me or blow up based on bleeding-edge tech being tossed around as a marketing stunt.
I’m a DeWALT person, and it’s not because their numbers or specs are higher. It’s not about their customer service, and it’s not about specialty tools. It is, however, about their tools never failing me. I never over-tax them, I clean them after use, and they last for ages, no matter what bumps, drops, or accidents happen. They work, and I don’t have to replace them. I can add to them, of course, but that can be budgeted.
My PERSONAL Opinion, not likely shared by ANYONE else here… is that the 8 Volt, 12 Volt, 20 Volt, and now FlexVolt 20/60 Volt are all the same system of tools. Small gyro tools and a flashlight are 8 Volt, There’s the odd tiny version of a Drill or Screwdriver or Saw in the 12 Volt area, but it is mostly made up of Instruments like inspection cameras, laser levels, and Wall Scanners, something neither the 8 volt, nor the 20 nor FlexVOLT tools have at all. Then there’s the standard run-of-the-mill tools that fit into one of three categories: 20 Volt (Brushed Motors), 20 Volt XR (Brushless/Extended Runtime), and FlexVOLT (20/60 Hybrid Extra Powerful Tools) that make up the 20 Volt Max Line.
None of the 20 Volt Max line includes the Instruments and Test Equipment that the 12 Volt line does, and the 8 Volt tools are significantly smaller than everything else. These are purpose-driven designs, as I see it. They are meant to be used all together. Drill a hole with a 20 Volt XR Premium Drill in some hard wood, grab the 8 Volt Max Gyro Screwdriver to put a screw in place. Scan a wall with a 12 Volt Thermometer, Wall Scanner, or Inspection Camera, grab the appropriate 20 Volt and FlexVOLT tools to do whatever is needed for the wall. (Anything from replace the Drywall, which would involve the Saw and Drill and Drywall Screwgun, to repairing Pipes or Framing work, which can go right up to the Miter Saws. Whatever you saw with the 12 Volt stuff, you fix or modify with the 20 Volt and/or FlexVOLT System.)
I can’t see the lack of complete coverage of all tools in all four Max lines as a coincidence, so the best I can advise is Invest. Invest in the tools you need, and take care of them so they last. No matter what you buy, just take care of them and don’t get cocky with them. They will last longer and serve your needs if you genuinely take care of them. It is often the case that one system or another won’t fill every need you have, so don’t be too frustrated by this.
Bremon
I agree with you on this Joe; as much as we mostly strive to stick to one battery platform you inevitably end up in multiple, or you miss out. And yes, the right tool for the task is paramount to longevity; pushing tools too hard kills them regardless of their colour.
Aaron
Joe, you put more thought and time into this post than DeWalt has into their 8v and 12v products the last 3 years. And the sad part is, I’m not joking.
JoeM
I know you’re not joking, though I don’t know how “Sad” it is. I agree. DeWALT has spent more time on marketing the need for each design, and trying to out-perform Milwaukee in sales. They’ve completely forgotten a key feature that has resulted from all this back-and-forth. That they’ve created a 4-battery Voltage Lithium-Ion System that work together in so many combinations that you can’t list them all without your head exploding.
The 8 Volt System… Has been a little neglected, but I see it as the “Tight Fit” system… the ones for when you’re crawling around in tight spaces, or the need for a bigger tool just isn’t there. The Gyro system is in THREE different Screwdrivers. Gyro 680 with the Gun/Straight switch, Gyro 681 and 682 are both Straight screwdrivers, one has a conduit reamer built in, the other is just a screwdriver. But those are tight-fit screwdrivers, and the Flashlight is a small-formfactor one. I can definitely see a Gooseneck or Right-Angle flashlight being added to the 8 Volt Family… if they ever get around to it. I can also see them using the 8 Volt battery on Lasers and Stud Finders for the home/diy market.
The 12 Volt Max System… Honestly I think is over-used, and over-thought. All the instrumentation, and of course the compatibility with the heated gear, is all it really needs to be. Other than them… What is there? A variable-handle recip saw, and a couple different Screwdrivers with modest Drilling capacity? I like some of the designs in the 12 Volt tools, but I really don’t like that they didn’t do them for the 20 Volt family instead. The Variable-Handle Recip Saw, for example, with the power of the 20 Volt Standard, XR, and now FLEXVOLT Batteries behind it? Maybe alter it to be able to handle Recip OR Jigsaw Blades? Come on. That thing would be helpful as hell! But I would keep the 12 Volt System Test Equipment the same. Line Level Lasers, Inspection Cameras, IR Thermometers, Imaging Thermometer, and whatever shape or form they get that Wall Scanner to work… that would be perfect for the system.
Now, look at how extensive the 20 Volt system has become. 20 Volt, XR, and FlexVOLT, all together. These are the power tools that are lighter and stronger than their 18 Volt NiCD predecessors. And the new ergonomics are fantastic. (I own a bunch of the 20 Volt system… I am more than a little biased in favour of their ergonomic handles and such… I’ve gone into retail stores and held the competition and just wasn’t impressed with the weight, balance, and comfort levels of the other coloured tools. The Ergonomics on the DeWALT have me a little spoiled.) But also look at what ISN’T in the 20 Volt System… all that tech in the two smaller systems… It’s not there… AT ALL… And frankly… I don’t think it’s an accident, nor do I think it was necessary. Lighter Tools with Lighter Batteries, Powerful Tools with Heavier Batteries. If you’re already going to be holding on tighter to the tool to start with, you might as well counter-balance it with a powerful battery.
I just wish DeWALT would see what they had here. SO many times I’ve wanted to shoot their marketing department for the craziness they thought was going to work on us. “It’s (Insert Market Speak Here) and New!” “Yeah… but… I already own DeWALT tools, I need one anyways… You had me at ‘Release Date’… Why do you have a job?”
There’s a Canadian headquarters not too far away from me. I may call the up and see about taking a tour or something. See if I can vent some of this straight at the horse’s face, so to speak.
Man_With_Plan
Very good topic, I might just add one more question, now that I know when to use 12v 18v tools what about going the extra mile say for instance milwaukee seems to be staying in the 18v line and Dewalt expanded their line with flexvolt with 36v and 54v (AKA 40v max 60v max) and even doubling batteries for chainsaws and their miter. What line is more efficient and cheaper to inherit?
Bremon
I find Milwaukee batteries more expensive than Dewalt. Tools generally more expensive as well. FlexVolt batteries are backwards compatible with 20v Max, but unlike M18 you can’t put a 5.0 amp hour battery on a tool that ideally uses a 9.0.
Milwaukee has wider battery compatibility on their 18v line, but I have extensive red and yellow and think the new 9.0 from Dewalt is superior to Milwaukee’s.
40v Max is a professional outdoor equipment line basically, no need to worry about it if you’re looking at construction tools.
Stuart
Tough call. I compared the 2 battery platforms, M18 and FlexVolt here:
https://14cyiuhvcgv.com/dewalt-flexvolt-vs-milwaukee-m18-high-demand/%3C/a%3E%3C/p%3E
FlexVolt benefits: Higher voltage allows for lower current and greater efficiencies, and potentially more power.
Tools like portable tables saws and cordless 12″ miter saws are finally possible.
M18 benefits: All M18 batteries fit all tools, although I believe there are some (but few) tools that cannot physically fit the High Demand batteries.
Dual-battery systems, like Makita’s X2, have some of the same benefits, but require more care to ensure batteries are matched or close to being matched in capacity.
Koko the Talking Ape
Terrific piece, Stuart. Thanks!
A W
There’s some great advice here: go 18v, look for sales, acquire what you need as you need it, look at Milwaukee, DeWalt, Bosch and Makita.
During sales season, if you get on Northern’s making list, they send out $20 off $100 and also $50 off $250 coupons that stack on top of sales. It’s a great way to pick up a good starter kit.
As a beginner, do a lot of research into how to safely use the tools you have. Safety glasses, hearing protection, and a good 3m respirator are just as important as the power tools you get.
Corded tools give you a lot of power, last longer, and you aren’t locked into the brand of batteries you own, but the convenience of cordless can save a lot of time.
I would start with:
Cordless Drill/driver and impact driver and work light.
(Corded or cordless) Circular saw, sawzall.
Corded Table saw. Compound miter saw.
A good collection of hand tools, but I think that’s outside the scope of the question.
You also want something to round the corners off of wood that you’ve cut: either a drum sander and/or router.
Consider: hackzall, jigsaw, oscillating multi tool, impact wrench, work lights, big fan, dust collection.
glenn
Although I use Milwaukee M12 professionally I agree with others here that for your purposes, 18/20v would be the best choice.
Also if you are on a budget don’t discount Ryobi 18v, they are way better tools than a lot of people give them credit for, plus they have a big line up of tool.s
Justin
I always put it like this: 12v tools are great if you already have the 18v version. As you said, the 18 can do everything the 12 can do, but the 12 cannot. I had a full set of Dewalt 18v and most of the same kit in Milwaukee 12v. 4 out of 5 times, I used the Milwaukee because they’re awesomely light and can do mostly everything. But that 1 out of 5 times you need the power, hopes and dreams won’t make the 12 volt any better. The only time I’d retract from that is if power is always available. Then, get corded everything and 12v for cordless. Although its getting less and less, there are still some times where the cordless just don’t compete with 120v.
Jay
To each his own. Get what you like and be happy. Makita, Dewalt and Milwaukee power tools do it for me, in that order, heavy on Makita. Today’s 18 and 20 volt tools are now so compact and powerful that for me it makes little sense to go for anything else.
ktash
Some tools should be cordless. Cordless drills are a must-have. 18 or 20 volt for sure. Top tier here since drills are the most used tool. Consider and research which tools are best cordless and which best corded.
There are a few other cordless tools I love that are not top tier, but are excellent. Ryobi cordless brad nailer and Ryobi’s worklight. Both of these have been reviewed on here. These are just examples for my work needs. I have Ryobi drills, but don’t use them much. These came with kits and if anyone wants to borrow a drill, they get these. My Makita 18 volt drills are wonderful. And I have some small Bosch 12volts for tight spaces (I do woodworking). They are great, too. But in general, I don’t buy 12v, since I need more power, and I’m a woodworker and do DIY. Way less than a farm.
Some cordless tools aren’t that great, for example, circular saws. They have specialized uses, but not much power and battery life is a problem. I wouldn’t consider cordless circular saws an essential tool, like a corded circ saw is. I love my Makita corded saw, too.
I do like both Makita’s and Ryobi’s wide variety of cordless tools. The advantage of Ryobi is that they are pledged to keep the same battery, and to me this is a long term savings. Also, their batteries are easy to come by. I also use them for my yard tools, but of course on a farm they would be inadequate. For tools I use all the time, I go with better brands, but have plenty of Ryobi. They seem to fill the niche that the Craftsman brand used to occupy.
If you can wait until about a month before Father’s Day there are usually excellent sales. Also Black Friday and around the holidays. Also check the clearance section at Home Depot whenever you shop there if you have one nearby. Some of them have great bargains. I recently got a second set of Makitas, the brushless Makita compact combo kit XT248R with 1/2″ hammer driver-drill, an impact driver, their fast charger and two 18V batteries (compact ones). It was $175 because it was being discontinued. That works out to $35/item. I’ve gotten similarly amazing bargains in their clearance section over the years. I do check the reviews on my phone or before I open the package at home. I’m giving this as an example of how you can save money if you watch for sales/check clearance.
Many things to consider, but this site is a gem for helping you get started. Good luck with your farm!
Hang Fire
I own both 18V (Bosch) and 12V Dewalt sets. The 12V tools are less fatiguing and have enough power for everything I do in the way of drilling, screwdriving and impact driving. My 18v system has a very nice 6.5″ circular saw, that I use for almost everything I previously used my corded 7-1/4″ saw for. If you want either a circular saw or a cordless impact wrench that competes with lower end air impacts, then you need 18V.
I would have never got the 12V except I got a crazy good deal on a 3-piece closeout (drill/driver, impact driver, and screwdriver). I just used the 12V set today to finish a big of cabinetmaking, the drill/driver drill holes, and the screwdriver was more than adequate to drive in 1.5″ long wood screws slightly below flush. I find myself using them more and more for work around the house, because they are so light and handy. But for a farm? They would work, but you’d run into the limitations sooner.
The best answer in tools is always “buy them all”, but for a farm, I would start with a large 18V system, just buy all of them at once for $4-600, and add the 12V later.
Mike
Buy them all! Both is the best answer! I love my M12 stuff and generally go for that first. But sometimes you just need the big power of a 18v. It appears to be damn near unanimous and I’ll agree on a farm I’d start with 18v as well.
On a farm I’d go Milwaukee….ok I’d go Milwaukee anywhere. You make fun of the 12v grease gun until you spend hours greasing gear by hand.
Aaron
You really can’t go wrong with Makita if you’re looking to go into one battery platform. If you have small-medium tasks, the sub-compacts are absolutely perfect and superior both in specs and in ergonomics/run time to brushed or brushless 12v from any company. If you want to go higher, get their full-size tools (which are still compact).
If you’re like me and don’t mind having more than one battery platform, I’d recommend the Milwaukee Surge/Fuel Hammer drill 18v combo kit and Hitachi’s Triple Hammer. I have both of the above as well as Makita’s sub-compact and got great deals on all 3. Don’t limit yourself to just one platform if the deals are good.
ktash
Agreed about the ergonomics of Makita drills. I have the full sized ones and just got the brushless subcompacts on closeouts. They won’t wear you out like the bigger heavier drills. It’s surprising how much drilling you will do even in making just a piece of shop furniture using 2×4’s or plywood sheets. I love their batteries, too. Fastest charging.
Aaron Rhodes
Best piece of advice I heard in all was check to what can be serviced locally. I have owned some great Bosch tools that were replaced just because cost of repair and turn around time were too long. I have had guys who worked for me replace rigid tools because repair was close to 2 months. I have not had great luck with DeWalts service department. But believe you are in good shape if you buy Milwaukee DeWalt or makita. 18/20v is for sure a need. Helping on farms I have used 3/4″ impacts a few times and lots of times it isn’t so much weight is an issue as rarely will you be using a single tool daily but you need enough power to get whatever job done you may run into.
Paul K
18/20 now to build. Few years down the line if you’re still at it and mostly fixing you might want a 12v line for a happier day.
You’ll be using these outdoors, over a fairly large area, in rough terrain, tall grass, etc. Don’t forget visibility. Ryobi, Dewalt and maybe Kobalt (new line, lots of unknowns though)
You’re going to be working a small organic farm so you’re gonna be broke, budget matters, ala behind every successful farmer is a wife who works in town. Ryobi scores high here, Kobalt has super affordable batteries (you might want more backups than the average homeowner or pro even to avoid having to trek back to the charger) and Ridgid (very good sales). Milwaukee has most core tools on great sales periodically if you can be patient.
You should really consider Ryobi for now. Decent tools, good price point, just watch out for the cheap drills. Wide variety of tools. You’re really a DIYer on steroids, not a lot of the repetition of a pro, but probably doing more heavy duty work than a avid diy homeowner. Ridgid or even Kobalt if you can get by with the selection for more power. The greater power and speed of pro-grade tools really benefit people on a clock with the skill to go faster or just a love of great tools and a comfortable budget. Probably not you. Ultimately, the cheapest way to get batteries and chargers is with new tools, so switching lines later isn’t gonna be that big of a deal.
Wayne
One of the reasons to get high quality tools is that they survive best. I’ve picked up more than a few good solid tools via eBay, with the fat price drop you’d expect.
Of course, batteries will be the sore spot. You can rely on Primecell to restore them – but I’ve never gotten a bad battery via eBay (while I’m sure they’re out there).
You can get bare tools via eBay to go with any new batteries you collect.
http://www.primecell.com/
firefly
Lot of great advice here. Another brand that hasn’t been mentioned is Fein. Fein is know for their oscillating multitool. While their pattern has expired and many other have come out with similar tool they are still the best in class when it come to oscillating tool. I really like they cordless SuperCut. It is awesome!
I also own a cordless 18v Fein drill. It’s big. It’s bulky but it’s definitely a whole lot more powerful than the 20v Dewalt that I own. Personally I don’t use it much because it’s heavier. I got it while it was on special. I just mentioned it as an example that not only there is different between 18v and 12v but among the 18v family there are different class of tool as well. For core tools such as drill or impact I think it’s best to see if the 12v will fit most of your daily need because they are truly a whole lot more enjoyable to use.
If you are on a budget I actually would start with the 12v line up from either Milwaukee or Bosch along with a good corded option for the core tools. Beside brand the right tool for the jobs also make a huge different. For example I have found that for cutting metal such as unistrut nothing cut it smoother than a bandsaw. I personally owe a Milwaukee M18 bandsaw. That thing make me smile every time I need to cut some metal.
Again it’s all based on your need. It’s also help to shop at the big box store for your first few core tools. It help to hold them in your hand to see which one are the most ergonomic for you.
fred
Even the April First comments have no hint of Joke in them! I think that Firefly has a good suggestion. Start with what you need first – probably a Drill/Driver (the impact driver can wait) and then visit the local Home Depot or better yet full line local industrial too distributor if you have one nearby. See if the Milwaukee, Dewalt or another brand feels right in your hand – do the same for same for a recip saw, and a circular saw – then armed with the knowledge go home and look over your buying options. The nice thing about today’s market – quick shipping etc. is that you may be able to wait until you have a job in the planning stage to buy the tools needed – rather than buy all at once on the speculation you will have a future need.
firefly
fred, you are right. I remember April Fool used to be a big thing for me. Back in the days my friend and I used to hit up all the tech new site then bet on which is the real April Fools jokes. That was when those sites actually spend a good amount of effort creating them. I don’t know if the jokes got old or maybe I am getting old…
Dave
I’d buy a 12v Milwaukee kit with whatever tools you think you’ll need the most when they’re on sale at Home Depot and then I’d buy CORDED tools. 30 years from now, you’ll still be using them… if the future mirrors the past, you’ll have been through about 8 sets and thousands and thousand of dollar’s worth of cordless tools AND BATTERIES by then….
Cordless is WAY better when working in livestock pens ( hogs will chew up a cord in one second) but I doubt you’re going to be dealing with that.
Profes
12v bosch brushless drill + 18v high torq model with side handle. ( daily use) productive!
18v compact for occasional users.
Brian
Background – I grew up overseas. My father was a commercial fisherman and now farms. I have an office job but own rural property and have done many projects over the years.
Look at what tools you need and see what product line (Makita, Milwaukee, Ridgid, whatever) has the tools you actually need now and most of what you will want in the future. No line is perfect. Remember that for some jobs a corded tool is okay. Think of how you’ll use it. For example I bought a corded oscillating tool because I basically only use it for flooring, and anyone that does flooring knows it’s hours of intermittent work and dragging a cord around is no big deal. OTOH, cordless drills/drivers are a must, and I personally find cordless circular saws safer.
As for 12v vs 18v – I vote get whatever tools make sense for that voltage. So what if you end up with both? For occasional use 12v is great; if you are installing a deck 18v is the way to go. Don’t forget air tools for serious business either. And don’t listen to anyone that says the 12v tools aren’t usually lighter. I have the m12 fuel driver and m18 driver and the 18 is much heavier. Likewise I have the m12 fuel and m18 fuel saws. The 18v saw is twice the weight. Does it cut better? Absolutely, but i can build a shed with the 12v just fine. It’ll chew plenty of 2x4s. Did I mention the 12v is cheaper?
Power isn’t everything. Tools are like firearms. More power is fun, but it’s also heavy and often unnecessary. I know which circular saw I prefer to operate over my head while on a ladder. Think about how you’ll actually use the tools 90% of the time vice outliers that may deserve an air or corded tool (jobs where you are doing stuff for hours in one spot).
Aside, as far as OPE tools, I wouldn’t consider 18v tools powerful enough for farm work. Go gas. Personally I have 80v greenworks for my suburban house and it’s the minimum I’d consider to be decent. The 80V Trimmer is a beast, mower is great on our st Augustine grass once I sharpened the blade and the chainsaw looks decent. For farm work I’d say they’re marginal and get real gas stuff.
Jeff
While we are on the subject, 12 volt tools have the same marketing issues as 18/20 volt batteries. Off peak charge they are 10.8 volts. Bosch innitially marketed theirs as 10.8 volts and changed the same batteries to 12 volts for competition purposes. In Europe those batteries are still 10.8 due to stricter truth in advertising laws. Any way you slice it it is three 3.6 volt lithium ion batteries. 3.6 X 3 =10.8
Kaycee
From recent experience in a similar situation, I went with the DeWalt 20V brushless tools to start with since I wanted power, features and long run time.
Then after that initail purchase, I backfilled any niche tools I needed from the 12V line. The 12V tool criteria was compactness/weight and features.