A reader emailed in, asking about Woodpeckers’ bar gauge (a Feb 2016 One Time Tool), and how it compares to Veritas’ everyday model.
In case you’re not familiar with bar gauges, they are adjustable length layout tools that are used to compare relative measurements and transfer reference lengths, and for other tasks where you need precision but not necessarily numerical values.
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Let’s say you need to fit a shelf inside of a cabinet, with the length between sides (including grooves) being 22-15/64″. Sure, you could try to cut a shelf to this dimension, but use a bar gauge to set the fence of your table saw, or cutting guide of your circular saw or jig saw, and you’re good to go. No math or exact measurements needed.
Matt wrote:
A few weeks ago, I bought a pair of bar gauge heads from Lee Valley/Veritas, and immediately they changed how I approach measurement and layout work. Sometimes it’s a bit annoying having to cut off a new line of wood if my current bits don’t fit a project, but it’s not a big deal.
I have been debating upgrading to their steel version though, as I suspect with longer bits of wood, the gauge will get less accurate. For $15, it’s a very useful tool!
I’ve been debating stepping up to the $65 Veritas steel gauge set, which still seems a good buy.
But then, in my inbox this morning, I revived an email touting WoodPeckers latest One time tool, their own version of the Bar gauge. The Woodpecker version looks quite handsome, but at a jaw dropping $250, I’m at a loss for what justifies their version over the competitions.
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I bought the Veritas bar gauge set from Lee Valley a few years ago, and although I haven’t used it a lot yet (no time for a lot of projects as of late), it’s definitely a fine tool that’s worth the expense.
The Veritas bar gauge set can span from 7-1/2″ to 44″, and they also sell optional 12″ extension rods to take things further. The standard kit comes with a couple of extension rods, ball tips for inside measurements, pointed tips for corner measurements, and mushroom-shaped tips for outside measurements.
As for the Woodpeckers set, you get 4 sets of different tips, and it comes with additional extensions so you also get greater range – 8-1/4″ up to 96-5/8″.
If you only need half that range, you’re paying extra for the 4 12″ extensions you don’t need. Woodpeckers is only offering this One Time Tool bag gauge set in a blow molded case, or Systainer case, so you’re paying extra for that too. You’s also paying for that fourth set of pins.
So, minus the extra extensions, the case, and 4th set of pins, and the price would in theory be $126, if you consider that the subtractions are valued at full price, but they’re not, they’re discounted. Ignoring that for a moment, a direct comparison suggests that apples-to-apples, you’re still paying nearly double the cost of the Veritas system.
There IS the option to build your own bar gauge,as Woodpeckers is selling all of the components separately.
So a set that matches the Veritas set would cost $45 for the bar gauge heads, $30 for the bare set starter set, $16 x 2 for 6″ extensions, $16 x 2 for 12″ extensions, and $15 x 3 for the 3 sets of pins.
Total: $184. The extra stuff that’s included in the set would add $124 to this price if purchased individually.
So why the price difference?
Honestly, I couldn’t tell you, I can only guess that it’s tied into the production scale and capabilities of both brands.
I am convinced that Woodpeckers makes a great product. Are their bar gauges superior to Veritas’? Maybe. I definitely like how the Woodpeckers bar gauge can rest flat on a work or tool surface. But other than that, it’s unclear.
If you want Veritas gauge to lay flat, you could always make some DIY stands for it.
I don’t remember if my Veritas bar gauge is made from steel tubing or solid rods, or how wide they are (my set is misplaced at the moment but I’ll try to find it soon), but the Woodpeckers’ set definitely looks to be made with solid steel rods. Maybe this contributes to the higher production cost.
There’s also the opportunity cost. If Woodpeckers is going to make a batch of One Time Tools, it has to be worth it for them to commit the machine and man hours to.
If I could spend $250 (or $290 for the Systainer case edition) on bar gauges, I would buy the Woodpeckers set, hands down.
When I bought my Veritas bar gauges, it was because I wanted that Woodpeckers set but could not quite justify the cost. I’m still not sure I could justify the Woodpeckers set. It does look to provide a little greater functionality, not to mention the extended range and extra tips (that you might not need).
I share in the “do I get more for my money?” mindset. While that translates well to some tools, it falls apart with others.
I’m assuming that it costs Woodpeckers more to make these tools, and that this is why these tools are priced higher. But maybe part of the reason they’re priced this way is because people will pay the price.
With the Woopeckers bar gauge set, do you get more tool for the money? Probably not, at least it doesn’t look like you do. And that’s okay.
That all said, I very highly recommend the Veritas set, but am also positive that I would be 100% pleased with that Woodpeckers set, once I got past the initial purchase price sting.
Hopefully this answered Matt’s question, but if you ordered the Woodpeckers bar gauge set during previous One Time Tool sprint runs, what do you think of it?
Veritas Promo Video:
Woodpeckers Promo Video:
Buy Now(Veritas Bar Gauge Set)
Buy Now(Woodpeckers Bar Gauge Set)
The Woodpeckers bar gauge set One Time Tool is estimated to ship in July 2016, and has a 3/14/2016 ordering cut-off date.
schill
Although I don’t have a need for either one right now, I like the Veritas one for the price – I wouldn’t be able to justify the Woodpecker version.
In the past, my tool for this was a rabbit ear antenna from a tv or radio. They work pretty well for inside measurements, but are obviously not as versatile as either of these. Then again, I didn’t have to worry about losing any parts.
Nathan
Only thing I could justify in the difference would be if the Veritas kit was made in china and the woodpeckers one was made in America. I’d have to look harder at the woodpeckers one.
But I don’t think that is the case.
BikerDad
I believe that all Veritas tools are Made in Canada. It is possible some are Made in USA. The Veritas Bar Gauge IS definitely Made In Canada.
BikerDad
Some observations:
While the ball end tips in the Veritas set look nicer (from a visual design standpoint), the pin tips of the Woodpecker set look to be marginally more useful.
The Woodpecker set has stainless steel rods, the Veritas set are steel of unknown character. Perhaps stainless, perhaps not, their description does not specify.
The Woodpecker set’s clamp heads are anodized aluminum, whereas the material used to make Veritas unit’s clamp heads is not specified.
fred
Veritas also makes little screw clamps (05N31.01) allowing you to make your own bar gauges out of flat wood sticks.
My old solution was much less expensive. I often just take 2 pieces of hardwood flat trim molding – sand down an end on each to a point and then use 2 or 3 Acco Binder Clips (from the office supply store) to hold them together. Not as ridged as steel rods – but with a little care this setup works fine for checking diagonals etc.
Stuart
That’s what the reader has now. I linked to that page in the quoted part of his question, maybe I need to pick a brighter color that’ll stand out better?
No, I really don’t mean to single you out for missing that part, I have been wondering about whether links are too easy to miss in text. On mobile, links are underlined, or rather there’s an offset bottom borrow, making them a lot more obvious.
steve
To make them underlined on a computer, find your style.css file
and modify line 356 to read
.entry-content a {
color: #06c;
text-decoration: underline;
Stuart
Thanks, I appreciate your offer to help! I like to think I know what I’m doing ;-), at least technically. The appropriate code is under a media query on line (line 2116), and there is a lot of reasoning behind it.
I’ve recently been toying with the idea of darkening the link code, since sometimes the color is light enough to possible miss. This seemed like a good time to wonder aloud. On desktop, I’d like to avoid underlining or adding bottom borders to links if I can help it. Maybe I’ll keep the color (I’ve been using that one here for years) but increase the font weight.
There are other issues with links on mobile, but visibility doesn’t seem to be one of them.
fred
Sorry that I probably did see the link – but did not immediately connect the name ( “pair of bar gauge heads”) with the Veritas product number that I knew about. If I had clicked on it, I would have known.
My real point was that there was an (probably more than one) even less expensive (but not so elegant) solution that I had used by way of ACCO (or store brand) binder clips to substitute for the bar gauge heads.
Brandon
I would recommend doing something even bolder to indicate external product links. Generally, I ignore inline links in posts on blog-type websites because I find they are mostly internal links put there for SEO purposes.
Stuart
I guess they could serve for SEO purposes, but I use internal links to redirect readers to related content of potential interest. Keep in mind that any post could be someone’s first exposure to ToolGuyd. Maybe the post gives them what they were searching for, maybe it turns them into a regular reader.
And in this post, the simpler Veritas bar gauge heads that attach to user-cut wood are not the focus of the discussion, and so I wanted there to be a linkout. There wasn’t a need for great emphasis, but I also didn’t intend for them to be so subtle so as to be easily missed.
Linking to a tool preview means I don’t have to copy/paste all the specs and features.
Plus, a lot of posts have great reader discussions in the comments section.
I’ll break out links that I think are of very strong interest.
I certainly understand your take on inline links, and have seen garbage for-SEO-only links on other sites, but I can’t think of a time when SEO purposes ever factored into what I linked to in a post.
For external links, I try to be sparing with the text, usually with a ($XY at Amazon), where they make sense and are convenient for readers. Since ToolGuyd has affiliate relationships with certain retailers (if you buy something through a specially tagged link, we get a small referral fee), and so I’m sensitive about drawing extra attention to such links, lest they look spammy.
Whether to an affiliated or unaffiliated retailer, brand page, or other website, Buy Now, See Also, Compare, and More Info links at the bottom get the “button” treatment.
(These comments will self destruct in a day or two.)
Brandon
Perhaps I painted with too broad of a brush, but I didn’t mean to imply you were linking simply for the SEO. Rather, that’s my general opinion across all of the blog-type websites I frequent. Certainly the inline (internal or external) links can be beneficial, but I usually ignore them (on any website, not just ToolGuyd).
Keep up the good work, Stuart. I know you ponder this more in an hour than I do in a month. I was just throwing out my two cents.
JMG
Two pieces of pencil sized dowel rod, some masking tape, and a pencil sharpener…
Honestly, I never could find the money to buy into a tool like this that might only see use once in a blue moon, and I always seemed to have dowels around the shop left over from some project when I did need to check something.
fred
Everyone is different – and while a bar gauge is not as essential as a tape measure or a square it can get used fairly often. My doing casework (making cabinet drawers and the like) had found me using my makeshift bar gauges regularly to check diagonals for square – and to insure consistency. I like this technique much better than just measuring with a tape or checking each corner with a square. I do agree that for my budget and work – I can’t imagine finding value in buying something as expensive as the Woodpecker’s gauge set.
JMG
For checking repeat outside dimensions, a larger diameter dowel, or even small square sticks, could be used with a cheap washer screwed to the end of each piece.
I once met a poor central american woodworker who made his own cutter head and built a wooden joiner around it. Scary dangerous, but the ingenuity was impressive. All from scrap material that someone else had thrown out.
Stuart
Me neither, at first. It took a while and seeing the previous Woodpeckers One Time Tool to realize a bar gauge is something I could definitely use.
Besides, ToolGuyd imparts me with the responsibility to try new and different tools and accessories.
Also, Rockler makes hardware that attaches to standard wood dowels, for a $30 solution (https://14cyiuhvcgv.com/rockler-bar-gauge-kit/%3C/a%3E%29 between Veritas’ flat bar hardware and complete set.
Kevin
I own the Veritas set. They are very well made, but there is one source of frustration with them: the clamps are plastic with brass(?) screws, and it is somewhat difficult to tighten them so that they don’t slip. The Woodpecker’s clamps look as if they would not have that problem.
With that said, it is NOT a ‘$250 problem’. I have bought quite a few Woodpeckers one-time tools—as well as a LARGE number of their standard tools—but it seems as if their pricing just keeps getting higher and higher, and it has arrived at the point where I just can’t swing the justification anymore.
AndrewC
I talked to Lee Valley and they said that their bar gauge set is made out of 416 Stainless steel and anodized aluminum, so the same as Woodpecker.
Lee Valleys set is made in Canada and Woodpecker’s is made in USA.
The reason why Woodpecker’s set cost more is because people will pay more for exclusivity. Each one is made in a machine shop to order instead of what Lee Valley probably does – contracting out a machine shop to make a batch of 1000 or more, and then waiting a few years to sell all of them.
Woodpeckers thick, red anodized aluminum blocks perform no better than the thinner black ones that Lee Valley uses. To most people, woodworking is a hobby, and people with the means are willing to spend irrational money on hobbies, just like weekend bicycle riders who spend a couple grand on a bike when, for non-competition purposes, a $600 bike would suit them fine. So I don’t think the Woodpecker brand will perform any better, but it may make some people feel better about the purchase.
Oh, if you want to extend the length of the Lee Valley version, you can just buy more rods ($14 for 12in extension)- Don’t think there would be any reason why you couldn’t use multiple extensions at once.
ERZ
Veritas has their own machine shop in Ottawa, Canada. I’ve been on a tour.
They make everything themselves.
They use the same stainless rods on many other products; so there might be some purchasing efficiencies there.
fred
I sometimes think that there are tool collectors out there who buy real collectibles like high-end antique planes – and new tools from folks like Woodpeckes and Bridge City Toolworks – with the hopes that limited production runs may one day make them more valuable. They might also have the appeal of looking real good on the shelf.
Over a lot of years I learned that I should to try to buy the best tool I could afford for the job. The most expensive tool was not always the “best” for me or my business. Getting to your point about hobbies , I don’t recall ever buying anything from Woodpeckes for my business – but I have bought some personal-use tools from Woodpeckers and one (the Kerfmaker) from Bridge City. I’m not sure just how cost-effective those purchases have been.
In a similar vein, recent Toolguyd posts about high-end knives – also had comments by folks who bought high-end watches (timepieces as the snooty advertisers call them) – both of which (IMO) are bought more for pride-of-ownership than for utility.
Stuart
Bridge City Tools? Some of their products are absolutely designed to be “multi-generational heirlooms.”
But they also produce some higher production products that are more in the “independent small maker” price range rather than “collectible zone.”
But Woodpeckers? I don’t think anyone is buying those tools and thinking that they’ll be getting a sweet payday from in 10, 20 years.
There is always a small premium and urgency tied to sprint runs. Will I ever be able to buy this again?
With Woodpeckers, it turns out that a lot of times, and answer is “yes, and probably with improvements.”
I bought a 640 square when the One Time Tool program first launched, and it was machined out of one piece of aluminum.
Then came the 640 ultimate square, with holes machined into the handle for lighter weight and great balance. A larger version was also introduced.
Now, the 641 square has been introduced as a regular item. Instead of being machined from a solid piece of aluminum, it’s made from 3 pieces of plate/bar stock and stainless steel dowel pins.
The new version is more expensive, but also looks quicker and easier to manufacturer, and with far less wasted material.
So when I look at One Time Tools now, I think to myself “do I need this now, or can I wait a while to see if I could have used it a lot?” And if the latter is true, I’ll keep in mind to buy the tool if it’s offered a second time. I figure that the more useful of the One Time Tools will be improved upon or at least repeated after 1-3 years.
Julian
How’s this for cool? After seeing this here, I checked out WP’s site just for curiosity’s sake. I never would put out that kind of cash for the product, though. I could def. see the handiness of it.
Anyways, my first thought was that they should also make some sort of beam compass ends to make it that much more useful.
Many times onsite I’ve had to create large arcs and I make it happen with whatever I have laying around but to be be able to do it with some precision and adjustability would be pretty handy.
So I emailed them just to throw out that suggestion, and the president of WP emails me back (they already make a set of ends for that apparently) and they’re going to send me a complimentary full set.
I’m no stranger to their products, I have the 812 square and the little dual triangle set among others, but for the most part I’m on the sidelines due to the cost/value ratio.
All I can say is wow – that’s cool!
JT
fred
Good deal – Sounds like great customer service.
My metalworking solution had always been Starrett trammel points – but they seem to have gotten pricey – at least on Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/Starrett-59A-Trammel-Divider-Points/dp/B0020A14BM
Charlie
I don’t see how either of these could be used to measure inside recesses at both ends, then remove the bar and return to the measured length. I use simple pinch bars, then mark one and return to the measurement. This is for inside mortises in rustic work.